The advice given seems to be the current standard. If you want to hunt surface fleets, you ll need at least 30 subs i would say. In addition I have a better template that adds AA and logistics. Conclusion is that regardless if we use a medium or heavy tank destroyer, their armor with only work against divisions without anti-tank. Target cost is in the 10-12k range. HoI4 Dev Diary - Ship Designer. But you can just spam light attack on light cruiser. Bay's Plane and Naval Unit Scale Mod makes several graphical ONLY changes to HOI4. 10 things I noticed/thought about HOI4. Reply reply. Finally, use destroyers for your torpedo attackers. From what I've heard from the MP regulars on the forum you're best off spamming early-ish destroyer hulls (because they're inexpensive) with sonar added and adding air cover if hunting subs. No, spam Destroyers and Battleships, maybe add some subs or Heavy Cruisers, then you've got a great navy. netherdraku • 4 yr. 1-Guard The Coasts. I know destroyers and CA without armor are harder to hit, but investing in armor for a 90% damage reduction seems much better than just relying on speed to. Used for balance. Way to expensive. Join my discord:. You can refit it to have some pretty amazing sub detection. From what I've heard from the MP regulars on the forum you're best off spamming early-ish destroyer hulls (because they're inexpensive) with sonar added and adding air cover if hunting subs. Once there are no screens left the light guns are allowed to target the heavy ships. All DD start with 1 DC attack, and the modules can add 8/12/16/20 attacks depending on tier. If you are dealing with land-based planes, 12-15 anti-air attack is enough to survive, and 20-25 lets you all but ignore them. Also Check out my Suggestion to Fix the US Presidency in HOI4 Expanded News Events Greek Political Parties Suggestions Byzantine Emperor Suggestions Democratic Hungary Leader Suggestions White Russian Advisor Suggestion Europa Universalis: My exhausting idea for a DHE with event chain for Korea in EU4 Greek Unit. It’s pretty simple, but takes focus to make it efficient. In this short tutorial esque guide I will show how the current best way to counter the Axis sub spam, as the Allies (specifically the United Kingdom). Destroyers are sub-killers, screen number and torpedo damage (due to numbers). These could be low in numbers, 6 to 8 40 width divisions allowing me to fill the combat width of 3/4. Basic Machine Tools. I know “add_latest_equipment” exist but ALE just gives everything whilst I want. Mar 24, 2006 22. well the original TNO was exposed as the toxic and degenerate shithole it was and as a result lost a large amount of fans and now some people on /v/ are trying to make a better version. Set to engage at high risk (sub3 or sub4 only). Destroyer are great against sub, but terrible at surface warfare. Here is a raw comparison: Plane type (100x). An army in HOI4 is a single unit with it's own stats, so sending 1 tank along with 7 infantry can effectively put all 7 in the tank. Why does the AI spam planes so much, i mean UK and Fra. The cruisers kill enemy screen ships. So, right now there are 2 main metas for man the guns, spam sub 3s and bombers, or Light attack heavy cruisers and torpedo destroyers with tug boats. Strike fleets should help you achieve either one of those objectives. Having air superiority is super important for spotting and battle. Question about the Naval Meta . 7-inch guns on Scharnhorst but was hit several times by the German ships' secondary armament and sank at 17:25. r/hoi4. The only 'necessary' navy are cheap escort destroyers if you will rely on convoys. You can also just spam destroyers/subs if you want an easiest way to maintain naval superiority and use bombers to kill ships. Essentially, all Capital Ships would gain a small number of additional attacks (2 for Heavy Cruisers, 3 for BC/BB, 5 for SuperBattleShip?) with less damage and (much. Fourth, use the Raiding Fleet designer if possible. Whereas, if you don’t need many torp destroyers anyway, refitting your early ones is a good way to improve existing destroyers that are poorly optimized. Creating a task force composition will also activate automatic reinforcements. A Heavy Cruiser and a few Light Cruisers will eat a 6-Destroyer sub patrol. If you start the game with a navy, stack all the subs in one navy and throw the rest of your navy in reserve. I feel like an armor system would counter destroyer spam. You can never go wrong with torpedos and it always is a good idea to build screen with a. No enemy airports = no red air, simple as that. The doctrine. -Jusp spam Naval Bombers and nuke the enemy fllets. 68 Badges. DD = Destroyer (Destroyer hull) SHBB = Super Heavy Battleship (SH hull) Naval missions When you press F2, the naval interface will pop up. Air defence. Build fast ships with Radar and spotter planes. Tank Destroyers will have more hard attack, SP Art will have more soft attack, and SP AA will have air attack. Lets look at some IRL examples. Building a tank destroyer division is something that may work as well. could be destroyers or light cruisers, both work in sp but mount only light attack on them. This page was last edited on 25 December 2016, at 08:31. There was a discussion about this within the past month on the PDX forums (sorry, don't have link handy). Honestly, you just need naval bombers to invade England. Also, destroyers have almost no health and get picked off quickly, light cl's with max armor would last much longer and counter shitty destroyers much better than just a destroyer spam. If you cannot afford to build BBs to counter enemy. Personally for me CLs are the winners of this update, in a flashback to the game’s. AA, AA tech (the artilly tech helps the ships), RADAR, and targeting RADAR. Take out Japan from China to generate war score, then land in Japan, its all take just 6 months to finish off Japan and annex all China+Japan(if Japan defeated China). No matter how much anti air I loaded onto cruisers, battleships, or destroyers, they would just get pummeled to death. DD spam works, it just falls flat against 5-10 CLs. A good task force composition is a necessary part of winning the naval game in Hearts of Iron IV, allowing you to protect both your coastlines and any convoys you have. Now compatible with 1. In Europe, a heavy tank destroyer is really handy. Escort Carrier - 1 flight deck, AA, Radar is you want, carrier 1 engine. 1 medium tank or (1936 light anti tank if your poor) for 50% armor bonus 2w. 3. and just spam subs and maybe destroyers to get naval superiority. The takeaway is that torpedo destroyers probably aren't worth it in most cases. I will use a 'multiplication factor' to indicate how effective a 1% increase in its respective stat is to overall combat effectiveness, assuming enemy aircraft are similar in stats to yours. They should have minimum guns, maximum engine and detection (radar, sonar, and for cruisers, floatplanes). Jul 9, 2001 37. As for navy, BBs should go together, CVs can use some damage sponges like CAs or BCs, but usually only up to 4 in number of CVs and capitals per fleet, fill the rest with screens at least 4 times in number of total number of. [41] Subs are fine for playing defense and raiding convoys, but they no longer give sea control to allow invasions. So i decided to give naval surface units (apart from destroyers) another chance when i bought MtG DLC. The thing this division is good at is attacking heavy defenses, realistically to soften it up before a armored breakthrough. Your 3 naval bases ain't worth the effort to build even a destroyer. The more meta is I think destroyer spam protecting heavy cruiser with soft attack. These patrols should be a single ship, either destroyer or light cruiser, set to never engage. ago. I have been playing this way more and more as it is easier and far less manpower lost. Let me explain. much everything, so you need light cruisers to do the heavy lifting. Light Engine II. Bren Mk. Archived post. People have built ONLY torpedo cruisers and destroyed larger mixed fleets but adding a few battleships is still a good idea. Have scout task forces of 2 scout cruisers + 6 destroyers. 10mpg with 10 gallons is 100 miles. 43. The destroyer design should go along with the design of your other ships. RELEASED SGc - Save Game Converter - converts save games to XML format for easy viewing in freeware XML viewers. M8oMyN8o. Turn your 18 width infantry with shovels into 40 width 14-4s with R. l to ensure that your capitals are effectively screened. Watch any lecture on WWII, and try to map whatever salient points you see from reality to HoI. This video gives a basic explanation of destroyers, their possible applications & relevant templates. arty for soft attack 21w. If you try to muck around the British islands, they'll be able to use their air support to send most of your boats to the bottom of the sea. CLs are more flexible (more modules that can be mounted) but also more fragile, and are screening ships. It occurred to me, after learning more about historical ships and their effectiveness, that Light Cruisers did perform quite well. 42 Badges. Although it's 190 miles from CA to PI, your destroyer will resupply in Hawaii and be able to sail the 190mi to the Philippines. It’s been awhile since I played and idk. This thread is archived. Business, Economics, and Finance. In HoI4, the default icon of a unit determines its type. Light Battery II. 6 IC/HP. Subs are the best scouts, best convoy raiders, and best minelayers. Heavy tank destroyer variants will maximize these to stats in a single brigade. Also using your armored divisions to fight the enemy's armored divisions seems kinda stupid since you will be losing lots of armor yourself. The thinking is, the light cruisers will kill the enemy screens with their abundance of light attack exposing the enemy capitol. 2. Submarines can hit destroyers, it's just a really low chance. Vanilla HOI4 doesn't work. g artillery, tank Destroyer, infantry, heavy tank divisions. ) OTOH the penalties are capped at 10, so if you want to build 20 carriers per fleet you will wreck any enemy fleet. I don't think any of them changes the naval AI more than Expert AI does but they could change other aspects that. Reply. Multiply this a few times et voila! Mostly empty max engine. . For the record, my play style is usually just spamming naval mines because that's all I understand. L. Scharnhorst opened fire on Ardent at 16:27 at a range of 16,000 yards (15,000 m), causing the destroyer to withdraw, firing torpedoes and making a smoke screen. 12mpg with 10 gallons is 120. The torpedo cruiser actually makes a great sub spotter though, since it comes with 20 base sub detection for some reason. Each paratrooper unit has a “weight” given by its template. The difficulty with HoI4 is there are SO many things that exploit the AI, or mechanics, it's impossible to find a balance everyone agrees on. Destroyer with only torpedos. You'll see the piercing difference is marginal compared to dedicated AT battalions, and uses fewer at guns too. AI in general ChillB Mar 3, 2021 Jump to latest Follow Reply Like playing. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Make sure to get a common border with Japan and get the Oil rich regions in the Peace deal. 800 Tacs and 1200 CAS will literally wreck them. The cruisers kill enemy screen ships. 1; Reactions: Reply. CowboyRonin. Discord! me on Patreon! me on Twitter:. Nah, not useless. Mechanized = low breakthrough, SPG = low breakthrough, tank destroyer = low breakthrough. You need to keep some destroyer and light cruiser to defend your fleet, but create a seperate flottilla with only destroyer and light cruiser. The tank destroyer board seems like it would be great for mixing heavy tank destroyers in with infantry, but so would the heavy tank designer. Focus on bombing enemy ships, and plan naval invasions. No one should ever make destroyers - they're absolutely worthless. Toggle signature. If you want torps for some reason, make a few torp dds. Go to hoi4 r/hoi4 • by. Easy, cheap, and effective. The US in the pacific, especially with the Base Strike Doctrine will be way more efficient with Light Cruiser as their screen ships than destroyer. The formula is scaled, and goes from 0% damage reduction at Armor=Piercing, to 90% reduction at Armor is 2x Piercing. In this video I look over the potential new naval meta. New research tab "Mechanized Infantry" containing Mechanized, Armored Cars (LaR), and Trains. Once those are filled up I start worrying about capitals Not sure if it's ideal versus players, but it shreds the AI1. You don’t need lots of torpedo destroyers. I stumbled into decision of which of the 2 choices I should pick as the US. Destroyer are great against sub, but terrible at surface warfare. Filling cruiser with "proper" heavy guns (not just a single to classify it as a capital) - is a counter to "light attack heavy cruiser" spam, actually. 363K subscribers in the hoi4 community. Puppet and annex to get the fleet. 3. Bren Mk. Set the fleet to convoy raid mission with: split. As long as there isn't a 3:1 ratio maintained there will be a chance for a fired torpedo to hit a capital ship. using fleet in being makes this combo super deadly. Watch any lecture on WWII, and try to map whatever salient points you see from reality to HoI. 5 per yard) x (QTY of naval yards dedicated) / (cost of design) = production cost in days. They win vs 80~ ship fleet with about 4 damaged ships. Go to hoi4 r/hoi4. The Ai cannot handle it. I don't know if others have different experiences but most people I encounter just say that sub 3 spam is unbeatable, I keep my destroyers. The purpose of infantry is to defend. Whenever you get air superiority spam nukes. Or in other words, a comparable heavy cruiser might dish out at-best 27 rounds per minute compared to an equivalent light cruiser at-worst 72. 7 armour and 13. It's a game, after all. Ardent scored one hit with her 4. In SP it's usually best to build cheap destroyers with a couple torpedoes and light cruisers with maxed out light attack. It's a luxury problem but it can save a lot of unnecessary work, though. Which makes them much more difficult to sink. variants) that can be produced by dockyards. If you remove ships from a task force composition they will automatically split off and go into reserve. SPArty has Piercing near 0 and a TD has A LOT. Interception detection). Cruiser "spam" seems to have taken that place, although some of the CC community seem to be testing ways to get more crew onto a cheaper hull (since ship crew is part of the calculation for how much control a ship gives). This guide is based on the naval meta of hoi4 multiplayer. -Super Battleship / Carrier style. But it can be lowered by positioning (up to -50% at 0 positioning) and increased by admiral traits (+20% screening efficiency from Fleet Protector). Put the surface fleet on strike force in the english channel. Ardent scored one hit with her 4. As with all content about what's "meta" in the game, this reflects my own opinion, based on experience and some math to get the facts straight. While they can be up to 3 or 4 times more expensive than a single destroyer, the added versatility and survivability is worth it to me. BEST SHIP = light cruisers with good spotting ability and perhaps good antisub or light attack (to take out destroyers, subs, or other cruisers). Get trade interdiction doctrine (left side), night fighting spirit, an admiral with Bold and Concealment Expert as well as making sure you always have plenty of oil. 5 production per day. 4 CVs + 2~4 BBs + Screen for each Battle Fleet. Nothing overpowered, but a respectable amount nonetheless. So your best option are Destroyer's and Submarines. HOI4 Tools SGr - Save Game Recorder - records, compresses, and archives autosave files in realtime, no game impact. And take of those mods. Torpedo cruiser. If you have just 1 destroyer in a fleet your carriers will nuke any sub fleet before your destroyer can get within range of anything. The remaining battleships and CA's I split into 3 equal task forces, with 3 scout task forces. You have to research that variant after researching the basic tank chassis. Operating in squadrons of 6 on convoy escort. 366K subscribers in the hoi4 community. Edit to link to my cut/paste. But, Naval AI is doesn't exist so you can't really go wrong with anything you do. #10. The problem the USSR faces is building up enough of a meat shield to hold back or slow Barbarossa until it can build up forces for a counter attack. Maybe if they expand on the trade and supply system, then navy could become more worthwhile. Then the torp destroyers kill enemy caps. 800 Tacs and 1200 CAS will literally wreck them. 1936 Battleship. (Optional) Just naval invade your enemy before they invade you, the AI is pretty shit at defending its ports, you only need around 10 divisions to secure a beachhead. r/hoi4. Split into 3-4 task forces of submarines under an admiral, preferably one with Bold trait and then the Sea Wolf earned trait followed by the Spotter or Superior Tactician earned traits. Sub detection +9. Convert back to Template 1 once your production issues are resolved. Finally, use destroyers for your torpedo attackers. The reason destroyer and/or sub spam is so common is it's simply easier to micro and let's you focus your time, research and industry on army and air force. Your navy, whether over the course of years or in one decisive battle, can make the difference between humiliating failure and righteous success. Overall against the AI its viable, but adding some CLs will help a lot. One transport plane can support a weight of 2. Construction 1. If you’re fighting in the Pacific, build fleets with ~4 CVs, some screen (I prefer CL), and some capital ships. You should aim for a total of at least 4-5 destroyers per cruiser. Any help would be much appreciated. I just naval bomb it out of the water without much effort. Carlcarl1984 • 2 yr. #3: Because of the (DD/AirCraft) Threat your build should be as follows. To each his own, personally i hate navy in hoi4 and everything that has to do anything with navy. and lost the Fuso to the USN destroyer screen. But the rational answer is to add support anti tank companies to your infantry templates. A basic panzerschiffe is going to cost 5235 IC 4S (steel), which is a pretty major investment for only 220 HP, which is an IC/HP ratio of about 23. Yesterday, I tested a few things. This is extra effective as Germany due to your Admirals, focus tree, research bonuses, and simple geography. Maybe AA to help vs bombers. g. Good news: it's better at dogfighting than the 1940 heavy fighter. Tank destroyers are cheaper to build than tanks but if you have tons of regular tanks, just use whatever you have. You should always add exactly one float plane catapult to all of your capitals. any tactic will defeat AI. Which will get blueprints next ? Vote here : This mod add severals blueprints for tanks depending of the technology level (interwar, basic, improved, advanced). Highlight the ships you want to retro, then click on the button under the admiral and select the new design. Playing the UK in a multiplayer game, it's 1944 and the German Navy has been pumping out more than 10 submarines a month it seems. Heavy TDs are best, but IC intensive. In my Germany game i got 2x superheavy battleship (upgraded full slots ofc) after 2 years of building time by 1942, some heavy cruisers and plenty of AA/submarine hunter. Replace some of Template 2's medium battalions with lights. In that case I usually design destroyers with the. Since their heavy attack is so lacking, they are better designed with the multipurpose role of attacking HC's and Screening ships. And our fleet composition will be as follows: 12 x Battleships: 95 x Lightcruisers: 95 x Destoyers: Total IC = 715,598 (2289 less than the British)Total Ships = 202 (35 less than the British) Navy is so-so in single player. Should I make tank destroyer divisions, or just integrate them in my standard tank divisions? This thread is archived New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. this plus your starting battleships completely ruins ai. Generally, you do not need SPG with heavy or medium tank divisions. I thought I'd just use paratroopers to get to North America, but distance from Faroes to Iceland is too long for my paratroopers. I’m not expert but the speed-armor tradeoff was a legitimate thing, and destroyer spam actually occurred (albeit with more than a single gun). Reduced number of destroyers needed to cover convoy routes from 1 destroyer per 5 convoys to 1 destroyer per 10 convoys. A place to share content, ask questions and/or talk about the grand strategy game Hearts of Iron IV by Paradox Development Studio. The weaknesses are enemy airpower, good ASW cruisers, or destroyer spam (but destroyers only deter and not kill). Also they are cheap and expendable meaning they are great for getting naval dominance 3. even the. The navy gives you the agency to go and do anywhere, and not be locked to the limitations of a contiguous land passage. Then the torp destroyers kill enemy caps. Playing as Canada and trying to serve their historical escort role. Built modern "patrol DDs". Also let the royal navy come to you - stay around the shores of the US/Mid Atlantic. ; About Hearts of Iron. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Double line at in Divisions, move them around to counter armour. And while you'll obviously get more torpedoes from the task force with the CA, you're still only getting a 3:1 screening ratio in a task force with 4 capitals; whereas, with the CL, you have a 6:1 screening. 2 HP. Look, the problem with naval combat in HoI4 is the same problem with land combat: Far too much of the tactical and operational levels of combat are abstracted and nonsensical. Your armor won't help you at all there. DD and Naval Bomber spam. Submarine Hull: 0. When it comes to choosing a ship to start one’s naval fleet in Hearts of Iron 4, it’s the Destroyer that can form much of the frontline due to its. Use fast light cruisers as screen killers with maximum dual-purpose secondaries, and light guns. there is 3 important modules to a good spam destroyer design. If you can afford artillery, give it everyone. Which can be sometimes the case because of the longer range of the tactical bombers. Capacity divided by consumption. 6% better. Better to go the avoidance route. Scharnhorst opened fire on Ardent at 16:27 at a range of 16,000 yards (15,000 m), causing the destroyer to withdraw, firing torpedoes and making a smoke screen. I decided to test out what anti air does exactly for a ship. 25 and 37. The Ai cannot handle it. 3 comments. Paradox needs to really study themselves some actual military history. Heavy tanks just have a better gun- mediums are stuck with the high velocity 2 gun at best, which has less soft attack than what heavies have. Their sole job is to find enemies for your strike fleet, so keep your strike fleet. CL spam is beyond stpuidly effective. You can put groups of DDs on Invasion support to have them tag along with the troop transports. Heavy AA is really good, Heavy arty is really good, pick only light or medium arty, don't mix both like historical templates do. the reason you build light cruisers as any naval power (uk. Infantry can also be upgraded to the point where they can handle. Screen on Battle Fleets are cannon fooder, send them back to repair at half health. You should aim for a total of at least 4-5 destroyers per cruiser. Radar cruisers and aa capital ships are useful as well if you can afford them. However, positioning in Vanilla rarely drops below 80%-100% so the answer is 3 if you have no special admiral. This gives you ratios of ~45. Jun 28, 2016;Roach DD/light attack CL with SHBB-Roach DD is destroyer specifically made for its low price, it can range to anywhere from gun 1, engine 1 1922 DD to gun 2, AA2, Engine 2 1936 DD. classteen • Fleet Admiral • 2 yr. So I favour simple 9 or 10 infantry divisions with engineers and support artillery. 6) Escort group/minesweeping. Still, cheesing the AI dumbness and stealing their fleet on. #4. In both world wars, particularly the first, they had a nasty tendency to suffer catastrophic explosions with nearly all hands lost. Destroyer II. Mostly its enough against most of players, who spamming. In this video I look over the potential new naval meta. It's the meta for a reason. There are essentially two metas. Lots and lots of mines. If they hit 0 manpower before you you win. Jun 20, 2020 @ 3:05am Originally. Bay's Plane and Naval Unit Scale Mod makes several graphical ONLY changes to HOI4. Add this ship to your fleet to get insane kill ratio against the AI. These can also be used to make it much less likely that your light cruisers get targeted by enemy attacks. Heavy guns shoot at targets in the gun line first, then at screens. The reason destroyer and/or sub spam is so common is it's simply easier to micro and let's you focus your time, research and industry on army and air force. #shorts #hoi4Spam subs A few destroyer squads and maybe a Light Cruiser or two as your flag ships until you have loads of dockyards and time. my personal favorite tank template and the original one of the 2 this template consist of 2 types of tank : the breakthrough medium tank and hard attack tank destroyer they both come to supplement each other's weaknesses and add their strengths. Spam divisions/planes. BETA SGp - Save Game Parser - extracts statistics from SGc. The most one could expect is that more anti air means that a ship would take around 30 naval. There are no class-specific bonuses at all for battleships, battlecruisers or heavy cruisers, but if built they share the array of global bonuses under this doctrine. Attacking is easy. The engine keeps them fast. ProcessTruster • 6 yr. Passive Sonar. I have played against sub 3 spam and don't find it any different or that much harder to kill than sub 2's. These patrols should be a single ship, either destroyer or light cruiser, set to never engage. The faster the screen is, the harder it is for the heavy gun to hit it. Same result. I have a feeling it will get crushed by a large stack or by naval bombers. HOI4 is quite alot based around speed, so even if the quicker solution cost more in the short term it may still save you alot in the long term. 369. For Japan the best template you can build is 44 width marine division consisting of lots of Marines, arty (4+), and one tank or tank destroyer battalion (Heavy in 1941+ is best, light is fine till then) for hardness and armor piercing. Moderator. Zone Spam, that is, just clicking every bloody zone for control, will typically only be effective if you have enough groups in your fleet to cover the specified areas. Put the patrol cruisers in the english channel on patrol, set them to never engage. 2. You also really want to over screen your capitals in the main death stack, if you leave them at exactly their on-paper screening, the instant you take a positioning penalty or lose a single destroyer you'll start to lose screening efficiency. Using. Because you have to heavily rely on your Tanks and their breakthrough value to accomplish stuff. I have made some 4 Carrier, 2 Battleship, 6 Heavy Cruiser, 6 Light Cruiser, and 18 Battleship Destroyer fleets, but to be honest I haven't really properly tested the setup.